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#1 mightydamsels

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 10:58 AM

Hey everybody! It's been like, ten years since I've been on this forum!
As per my feminist ways, I have started a petition to the creators/writers/director (s) to make the main character of the new Star Wars franchise female. I have posted this on Reddit and have received both positive and negative views ("Its Star Wars not kitchen wars", "Don't ruin Star Wars!" Etc.). But I am hoping that even if you guys don't sign it, that it will as least spark an excellent discussion about the need for more women in lead roles in movies like this.

http://www.change.or...aracter-female#

Thanks for reading, thanks if you sign and thanks if you leave a comment, good or bad.

Happy New Year everybody!!

#2 SpleenBeGone

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 11:16 AM

I could go for seeing a hot girly jedi type.
Probably not what you were after, but still. :P
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#3 Wolf

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 11:32 AM

I demand more aliens resemble anthropomorphic animals.

#4 Calvary

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 11:35 AM

I support a female protagonist so long as she is butt nekkid.

>3>

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#5 Guest_ElatedOwl_*

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 11:40 AM

I don't mean to be rude, but, why does it matter what sex the main character is? If someone thinks a woman can't be independent or whatever, the main character in a movie isn't going to change that. Likewise, the main character being female isn't going to empower or impact anyones life enough for it to matter - like, if it honestly changed someones life that the main character was a female than their life was unstable to begin with anyway.

#6 mightydamsels

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 11:46 AM

I think its important because not only will little girls see that women can play the lead character, but little boys will as well. Men are quite often left out of the equation when it comes to women's rights but it is crucial to have them on board as well. Star Wars is marketed for males, which is fine, but they need to broaden their horizons a bit. I am not asking to have pink Star Wars lunch boxes or glitter strewn about the set, but because Star Wars has such a large following, it would be an excellent starting point for the road to equality in entertainment.
And, I totally appreciate your comment, I don't think it is rude to ask a legitimate question.

#7 Guest_ElatedOwl_*

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 11:54 AM

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying its outrageous or that I'd be against a main female lead, I just don't see the point. If you're a strong/independent woman a movie isn't necessary to show that, only you are. If anyone is daft enough to think that someones sex should dictate what they can or cannot do then their opinion doesn't matter anyway.

#8 Calvary

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 01:02 PM

I think that Star Wars has had a somewhat varied cast-list by gender any way. You have Padme who goes on to be one of the most powerful voices in the Senate, Leia - who manages to kick arse just as well as Han Solo and a multitude of female jedi that I don't know the names of. Oh, Adi Gala, is one for instance. Focusing on a franchise where equality isn't a big problem seems like a bit farcical to me.

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#9 Diabolical_Jazz

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 01:25 PM

If anything, Leia kicks *more* ass and is *more* competent than Han. Han messes up a lot and always has to count on luck to bail him out. Leia takes charge and solves problems.
She's a complex and interesting character.

I consider myself a feminist (or in-support-of-feminism, for those who are confused by the idea that a male can be a feminist)
but I don't really see the main character of Star Wars being female as a major issue. I think it's more important that the female characters, whatever their role in the story, be well-represented and portrayed. Star Wars has generally had a good record with that sort of thing. If you disregard the prequels, which most people do.

I don't mean to undermine your cause or anything. It would be swell for there to be a female lead in the next star wars. I just don't feel like a petition is necessarily necessary.
I don't think he needs to be immortal. I think all he needs to do is to write the right story. Because some stories do live forever.

#10 Affray

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 04:49 PM

Princess Leia more than fills the quota for strong female main characters in Star Wars.
There are also: Depa Billaba Stass Allie Aayla Secura Adi Gallia Bultar Swan Jocasta Nu Yaddle Bariss Offee Luminaria Unduli Shaak Ti
All female Jedi, the first column of three are on the Jedi Council.
And that is just the Jedi, there are many non-Jedi women in the universe that pull some weight.
Just because the main hero is a man doesn't mean women aren't integral.

That being said, I have noticed time and time again that feminism is the belief that equality can be achieved by focusing on the interest of one side.
If Star Wars ended up with a female lead, sure why the hell not.
If not, who cares.
If for some magical reason a female lead was cast and it was because of a petition to make it that way, that would only sully the intentions of all feminists in that regard. You can't have your cake and eat it too as they say.

Women have plenty of heroes.
Perhaps they should be appreciated instead of trying to bend the world around what women think they don't have.

It is perfectly acceptable to fear and admire a being you could not possibly understand.


#11 Calvary

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 04:51 PM

Affray, also known as Affray Irontongue.

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#12 mightydamsels

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 07:46 PM

I certainly agree that Leia is absolutely top notch and out shines many of the other characters in many ways. However, she is ONE female character out of how many men? I am sure there are plenty of great female characters in the novels, but I am strictly speaking about the old trilogy (not that garbage that came out a few years ago..).
To be honest, I don't really think that my little petition will do anything. The same goes for my blog (there is always hope though!). But, I love to start discussions regarding women in entertainment because there are so many different views, good and bad.
I am not one of those radical feminists that think all men should perish and leave women alone. I actually think that there needs to be a revamp of the way men are portrayed as well (you all can't be macho, blood thirsty heroes..).
My point is is that women are shown as second rate, the girlfriend or love interest and rarely get to star in a movie where her chest isn't heaving or sweaty. So this is why I do it.
So, agree to disagree I guess. But all comments are welcome.

#13 Calvary

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 08:01 PM

It is vital that there is equality between gender, races, creeds, ethnicities and religious or lack or religious beliefs. As a race, humanity would advance so much quicker because of it. I am a firm believer in equality of all people, however I do not refer to myself as a feminist because fundamentally I think feminism is flawed in that it has no clear and solid definition of its objective. One might suggest that ultimately it is to bring gender equality and that is fair enough obviously, but it ends up going beyond that I think.

I don't follow super heroes or popular film culture really, I couldn't tell you the plot of The Avengers or the fleshed out story of Star Wars, however I think that it would be vital to your cause, at least initially to promote strong females in real life in lieu of fantasy heroes. Furthermore, focusing on your point specifically, you can't just miss out three films in the series because you don't like them, nor can you ignore the rest of the franchise for the same reason. I find it bizarre that you would miss out all the female heroes in later film and works when our values on equality have shifted positively in recent times just because you don't like the films. What does that say about your approach to the matter?

Not to sound rude but I think your argument needs some reworking.

Moreover, can you tell me a little bit on your opinion of a real-life female hero, Indira Gandhi? I'd be interested if you can give me a valid response on her role in actual world politics as opposed to Laia's role in a fictitious world?

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#14 No-Danico

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 10:43 PM

People, you’re all wrong. Disney owns Star Wars now. The main character will be an anthropomorphic rodent with giant eyes. If anyone gets an owie from a lighsaber, princess Leia will come out, cry a little, and they’ll get better.

Seriously though, I haven’t watched the new cartoons, but didn’t they make a female jedi who’s a twilek? And aren’t twileks just a race of alien strippers? Seems like that’s a step forward. And in the books, aren’t Han and Leia’s twin kids the protagonists? If they make that the next movie, they would have a strong female lead.

And not to make this about Firefly once again, but look at Zoe from Firefly. And little ninja River. Zoe is an incredible badass, but still a loving wife. Her husband was far more feminine than her, but still awesome. They had great chemisty together.

Spoiler


And is River the awesome queen of awesometon?

Spoiler

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#15 Affray

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 12:24 AM

I certainly agree that Leia is absolutely top notch and out shines many of the other characters in many ways. However, she is ONE female character out of how many men? I am sure there are plenty of great female characters in the novels, but I am strictly speaking about the old trilogy (not that garbage that came out a few years ago..).
To be honest, I don't really think that my little petition will do anything. The same goes for my blog (there is always hope though!). But, I love to start discussions regarding women in entertainment because there are so many different views, good and bad.
I am not one of those radical feminists that think all men should perish and leave women alone. I actually think that there needs to be a revamp of the way men are portrayed as well (you all can't be macho, blood thirsty heroes..).
My point is is that women are shown as second rate, the girlfriend or love interest and rarely get to star in a movie where her chest isn't heaving or sweaty. So this is why I do it.
So, agree to disagree I guess. But all comments are welcome.


As far as I am concerned every person who considers themself a feminist is a radical.
There is the desire for equality, and then there is feminism.
In this day and age feminism is a dead cause, mostly because women got all the rights they wanted about forty years ago.
I hear all that jazz about how women make less money than men doing the same job, but every woman I have ever worked with in the same position made the same amount of, or more, money that I did. It was based on seniority, not gender.

As for men needing a revamp in our gender role, I disagree.
What is the point in having two different genders if we can't be different?
Men are, on average, larger and more physically aggressive than women.
It only makes sense that when a role in a movie (or in real life) is along those lines that men tend to fall into the spot.
Watching Jane Rambo kill a bunch of people and act like a rough and tough war veteran just would not have worked.
Also, there are enough men in the media (and real life) that are quite the opposite of the macho man type, and they are some of the most popular.
Skinny nerds score almost as high as hunky meatheads in terms of popularity with the ladies.
So the tables have already been twisted in recent years as far as what makes a man a man.

As far as women only being cast as second rate characters goes I don't think that is quite so.
Alice from the Resident Evil movies for example.
She is the epitome of a powerful female character.
Smart, fast, strong, a survivor, and also does all of her ass kicking in a little red dress.
In the games that the movies are based on you play as either a male or female character of equal importance and effectiveness, yet for the movie they chose a super powerful and capable female lead.
That is just one example of women not being thrown about as second rate eye candy.

That being said, I don't think there is a single thing wrong with the way that the two genders are portrayed in most media today.
There are masculine men, and some that are quite the opposite.
There are women who sit perfectly comfortable in the role of the bodacious babe who gets paid to be pretty, and there are women who don't take shit from anyone. There is a balance to the system we have going here, it just isn't cut and dry.

Equality is a tipping scale really.
You can't lean on one side of it and expect all the marbles to stay where they should.

It is perfectly acceptable to fear and admire a being you could not possibly understand.


#16 SushiKitten

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 08:36 AM

I don't think having a female lead in Star Wars is a step in the right direction. Honestly, I think any of the Star Wars that come out now will probably be looked at in disgust because ew, Disney. I don't see a point.

That being said, I do believe there is a need for more women in less traditional roles in movies.

I don't think it has to do with feminism more than it does seeing gender equality in the workplace. I always bring it back to engineering, but I want to see more women choose career paths that aren't fashion designer, cosmetologist, vet assistant and the like. Girls have those options pushed upon them in high school, the media says they should have more interest in such things rather than science or something more considered a "boy" thing.

I want to see women designing things for women rather than having atrocities like this. And it sure as hell would be nice if a career in science wasn't considered abnormal for women, then there wouldn't be the need to make something like this. Especially in engineering, there is still a stigma towards women and it results in reduced pay and sexual harassment.

I'd like to see change and I do think it starts with the media we consume everyday, especially the ones that younger adults thinking about jobs are exposed to. However, I think it comes down to the education system and how it treats career paths that are traditional for a certain gender.

This is more or less thought vomit, but it is something I have thought a lot about, and maybe one day it will be more than thoughts. I would love to create a blog or a cause for this, maybe something that could actually make a difference, and isn't cheesy-stupid like most "girls in non-traditional roles!" things usually are. Being one of five women in a class of fifty-something computer/electrical engineering students, this cause is something that is rather close to me, and it is something I've had to face first hand. I can tell you I've had to face quite a few condescending male TAs when I've needed help, and I can tell you it was not because I was younger.

#17 Bowsette

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 08:51 AM

I am sure there are plenty of great female characters in the novels, but I am strictly speaking about the old trilogy (not that garbage that came out a few years ago..).

This is what I hate about feminists in general. They pick up solely on things that support their beliefs, even if there has subsequently been things that completely demolish that logic. Example: A list of 60 Star Wars females whom are not portrayed as weak but since they don't feature in "the old trilogy" you're ignoring it. That's stupid. Additionally, whether you like it or not, there are SIX movies, not THREE. The mere notion of ignoring half the movie franchise because you don't like it shows that you haven't thought this through. The fact you're ignoring the sub-series' of the franchise, either through not having looked into it or purposely ignoring it again, shows you haven't thought this through.

Despite being a woman, I completely disagree with feminism, as it tends to be promoted as "We want equality! And also this, this, and this." I don't give a fuck if a movie character is strong or weak, or whatever. I care if a movie is interesting to watch. Additionally, if I were to liken myself to a movie character, I would sympathize more with a realistic character. A rom-com or one of those "based on a true story" movies is far more likely to appeal to me and have me look at similarities between myself and the character/s than a movie based on hurtling across space firing badly-drawn laser cannons.

I agree with Gol~. Rather than focusing on fantasy, maybe try promoting some real people who do real things.

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#18 The Robstar

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 09:12 AM

I duno as a lead, but I wana see a female SITH LORD!!!! Darth Zannah is like the sexiest/badass most awesome female villain EVER!!!!
THE HELL YOU READING FOOL???

#19 Diabolical_Jazz

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 10:49 AM

I like y'all too much to argue an issue so close to my heart, so I'll post this instead:

http://www.harkavagr...ndex.php?id=341
I don't think he needs to be immortal. I think all he needs to do is to write the right story. Because some stories do live forever.

#20 Affray

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 01:37 PM

I like y'all too much to argue an issue so close to my heart, so I'll post this instead:

http://www.harkavagr...ndex.php?id=341


Hah!
A million times hah!

You should never be afraid to speak your opinion freely among friends.
Especially here.

An assembly or meeting place for the discussion of questions of public interest.
A gathering of free thinking to share their free thoughts freely.
Without opinion, civilization would never have been.

It is perfectly acceptable to fear and admire a being you could not possibly understand.